This shouldn’t be the image of Hack Day - Simon Willison - http://simonwillison.net/2009...
Oct 19, 2009
from
Paul Buchheit,
make some noise,
Abraham Romero,
Olcayto PEREZ,
el burrito,
Keith Bennett,
Ritu,
Jeremy Hylton,
Thomas Hawk,
Burcu Dogan,
Mitchell Tsai,
David Cook,
Wulffy,
Tudor Bosman,
Alex Scrivener,
Amy℠,
Alessandro Marocchini,
Sunny (The Geek Lord),
Miller Tzou,
Martynas,
Sachin Shekhar,
Cumhur Kızıları aka Zeus,
graywolf,
minus-one,
anna sauce,
Peter Renshaw,
Tzury Bar Yochay,
Rob H.,
junrxu,
MG Siegler,
Aaron Berman,
Red Label,
kami کامی,
Wally Punsapy,
TH Schee,
Jenna Bilotta,
Susan Beebe,
April Buchheit,
Jessie,
sofarsoShawn,
Rodfather,
Oguz Serdar,
Dan Hsiao,
Lola Bean (Penguin),
Anne Bouey,
OCoG of FF, Jimminy,
Kenton,
Peter Hoffmann,
Richard Chen,
Stephen Mack,
travispuk,
and
Zee.
liked this
"I’ve heard arguments that this kind of thing is culturally acceptable in Taiwan—in fact it may even be expected for technology events, though I’d love to hear further confirmation. I don’t care. ... If we want an all-encompassing technology scene, we need to actively work to cultivate an inclusive environment. This means a zero tolerance approach to this kind of entertainment. Booth babes, tequila girls, and scantily clad gyrating women simply set the wrong tone, here or abroad. Heck, this isn’t just about offending women—many guy geeks I know would be mortified by this kind of thing." Amen
- Bret Taylor
yuck. those are some sad photos.
- Jason Wehmhoener
Too true. Friends of Lulu has been trying to make this point to the comics industry for years.
- Spidra Webster
This was company sanctioned? Wow, someone needs to have their head read.
- Kenton
Very difficult to believe the sincerity of an apology that clearly comes in response to outcry. However, I do believe them when they say it won't happen again.
- Spidra Webster
Don't worry, Cristo. There are still plenty of places where you can get jiggle and blow.
- Spidra Webster
You can take your laptop when you go for a lapdance. In the winter, the goils might be esp happy to grind on your laptop. If your machine is anything like mine, it's plenty warm for winter!
- Spidra Webster
So would it make it all better if they added male strippers?
- Rodfather
Yes, just what the world needs is more zero-tolerance policies!
- Gabe
No it should, that's hawwwwwt
- sofarsoShawn
This event, and responses on this thread are pretty appalling. As a female in tech, and regularly attending meetings as the only female in a room of 10-30 males, this just illustrates one of the reasons. It's hard enough to just do your job and get heard, much less go to "company tech events" that are clearly geared in every way toward men. sickening.
- Jenna Bilotta
Cristo, in this case, you're pretty much just wrong.
- Jason Wehmhoener
I thought humor was supposed to be funny? Also, your humor is not original and I'm exposed to this kind of joke day in and day out. It's yet another reason women might feel alienated in tech.
- Jenna Bilotta
Did Carol Bartz address this yet?
- Red Label
Red Label, see Glen Campbell's comment above.
- Jason Wehmhoener
Can they ban PHP instead of women? Afterall, the women are mostly offensive only to women, but PHP should be offensive to everybody.
- Gabe
Why are people such prudes?
- Tanath
"Well, this just strikes me as funny, and I doubt I'd want to go to one of these without those girls there" ~ do you mean it's funny like dwarf throwing is to short people or minstrels to people of colour or how about sheep jokes to new zealanders? The excuse of "hey we're geeks and if you don't understand *cognitive dissonance* - like we respect women hackers but also like naked chicks on stage" is wearing a bit thin.
- Peter Renshaw
as long as woman play no bigger role in tech you will see male related stuff on such events. why should we bend reality. you should pity the lack of interest of femals regarding tech-development (and not just sales) if you feel the need for pity
- Chris Hofmann
I'm pretty sure the guy who wrote this article is gay. Hot chicks in short skirts FTW!
- Garin Kilpatrick
I dunno.. my lesbian friend kinda liked it. (me too).
- Martynas
We're simply a nation of Puritans who say one thing and indulge in the opposite...in secret.
- ‘-.-’ Tutivillus Grift
FFS, people. This wasn't just dancing girls - it was lap dancing. http://news.ycombinator.com/item... tries to spell out why that is wrong as clearly as possible, but I think Jenna said it pretty clearly, too.
- Nick Lothian
Save me a Seat at the DRIP RAIL!! ;PPP
- Billy Warhol
@Tanath I'm far from prudish, believe me, but when this tactic is used to promote something, it makes me feel like they're promoting it to someone other than me. I went through the same thing in the '80s with marketing of musical equipment; it was very clearly pitched to guys. Just not very smart marketing if you want a wider audience!
- Eph Zero
Hacker news claims sexual discrimination. It seems as though the result would be to put the female dancers out of a job. Let's hope they find some other employment.
- Tim Tyler
++joey I've experienced everything she mentions in tech, and constantly being called agressive, while my male counterparts are called "enthusiastic" its not ok. And no matter how hard I try to get male coworkers to see this, they just think its all in my head... it sucks.
- Jenna Bilotta
Jenna, you are aggressive in a good way only. Aggressive people change the world. Empathetic aggressive people change the world for the better.
- Daniel Dulitz
Oh yeaaah, porno chicks sooooooo hawwwwwwwwt
- sofarsoShawn
And it's not just missing the mark with women...what about gay men? Surely there are one or two in tech...
- Eph Zero
Marketing departments care little about pleasing small minorities.
- Tim Tyler
That was a reply to the two comments immediately preceding it.
- Tim Tyler
@Jenna In my experience "he/she is aggressive" is often an excuse by people who can't stand up for themselves. Daniel is right.
- Nick Lothian
++jenna Have you had the 1:1s where you've been asked to tone down your opinions because people get the wrong idea? What idea would that be, I sometimes wonder. Anyway, back on topic, I am far from a prude and I enjoy taking my boyfriends out for lap dances when the mood strikes but this? Not even close to being ok. A professional event should remain professional.
- EricaJoy
Let us also not forget that Yahoo is a publicly traded company that has shareholders to answer to. You really think shareholders want to be paying for lap dances? Doubtful.
- EricaJoy
I expect Yahoo shareholders appreciate the value of holding and pulling in young male developers by using sexual stimuli - but don't much care for the resulting international attention.
- Tim Tyler
Re: hiring discrimination - let's not forget that this was a hack day, not a job interview. If they had paid for a creche instead, would we see a similar outcry about discrimination in favour of women?
- Tim Tyler
I am an so call 'male developer' here in Taiwan. In my point of view, I felt that comments about the 'sexual' and 'hr to blame' note should be some kind of misunderstand. I think the hack day@tw is hosted like big event and its a contest between hackers.,In big contest, people do have something temporary transfer/release their tension. Take superball for example, half-time show is one of this activities. If you focus on the 'half-time show' alike to blame, what else should I say? I dont' think this activity is part of hack day spirit. Not At all.
- marx